Being a British guy in 2015 is not easy.
21-century pressures are changing.
No way.
- The way we live... - Women are seen as superior to men.
..the way we love...
If you are a Muslim, you cannot be gay.
It's as simple as that.
..even the way we look.
That's silicone?
- Yeah. - This is mental.
In this series, I'm travelling to the extreme edge...
HE GRUNTS
..of modern British masculinity.
They basically said, "The only way you can stay
"is if you agree to be exorcised to get the demons out of you."
50 years after women began a march for equal rights,
the battle of the sexes is being fought on a new front.
The state of gender relations is at its worse, probably, for 100 years.
But this time, it's not by women...
Men rape, men rape.
That's all we hear about - that men are rapists.
..it's by young men.
Men get murdered more, commit suicide more,
men are homeless more,
men are raped more in prison than women are, total.
I want to know why so many young guys feel overlooked...
Women are no longer trained to submit to a man, to serve a man.
..overly judged...
I think the UK, especially the media, needs to decide
whether or not they want freedom of speech
or they want to stop people being offended by comedy.
..and under attack.
I feel there's sort of that concerted attempt to shut men up.
And as growing numbers take to the internet...
'Hello? Hello?'
..and social media becomes a weapon of hate...
"The things I could do to you, smiley face. Dumb blonde."
..I want to find out why a new generation of men
thinks the real victims of sex discrimination are guys.
I'm pretty confident that women's issues are being dealt with.
Men's issues, not so much.
This programme contains some strong language.
It's Sunday morning. The perfect time for a lecture
by a man who teaches guys how to get more sex.
Meet American blogger Roosh V.
So, what I wanted to talk about today is having sex with
girls you don't really like.
I probably am not going to spend more than a couple hours just
to access their warm, moist cavity hole.
'Roosh made his name as a so-called pick-up artist,
'writing guides for young men on how to sleep with women
'around the world.'
He's got a book called 30 Bangs.
Wha... What?!
Bang Ukraine, Bang Iceland, Bang Poland, Bang Lithuania.
Don't Bang Denmark. Apparently, Denmark isn't worth banging.
But in 2012, a US civil rights group included
Roosh on a list of websites they branded hateful and misogynistic.
British girls are busted.
You know they are not that old but they just look old,
like they have been working in a factory or coal mine
their entire lives.
But he hasn't let that hold him back -
he's now on a world tour.
'Though from the sounds of it, he's expecting trouble...'
He's actually kept the venues that he's doing his events at a secret.
Up until the very last minute.
According to his website, the reason is
that he is worried about feminists.
Is what he is doing and saying
so offensive that people are going to try and shut down this event?
The name of the talk is The State Of Man.
One of the first bullet points in terms of what his speech will
contain is something about the paradox of modern women.
It feels like it's a lot broader than,
here is how to chat up a lady that you fancy at the bar.
'On the outside, it doesn't look like anyone is about to storm the doors.
'But inside, I'm starting to notice a real atmosphere.'
Thanks. 'I'm not sure anyone wants me here.
'We've already agreed not to show the faces of anyone who wants
'to remain anonymous.'
I'm pretty sure this is the first time
I filmed anywhere where EVERYONE insists on it.
Roosh's topic today is the state of man,
maybe it is more controversial than I expected.
Sorry to jump in front of the queue.
I just want to say thank you for having us here, man.
A lot of people have turned up today to hear you speak.
The reason I came here is
because the percentage of English men who read me is very large.
And that is a weird thing because I'm not from here.
The problem is, men are not allowed to speak the views that
I am speaking.
It takes an outsider to come here and not be afraid
of the hate crime laws that you guys have to give the truth.
And so I wish there were more men here who could share their views
but if they do, we all know that people are going to go
after their jobs and shame them.
You've got all shapes and sizes in here.
It is really a broad spectrum as well in terms of race and background.
And it actually feels quite excitable in here.
You know, there is a room full of men who are excited
about what they are about to hear.
So am I.
Something has happened in the past 50 years
where women are no longer trained to submit to a man,
to serve a man.
The very idea of beauty
and aesthetics is being demolished to where now women are being
applauded and encouraged to look like fat, outer space cyborgs.
Women and gays are seen as superior to straight men.
Anything that a woman or a gay person wants is theirs.
But anything you want - sorry, we cannot help you.
All of you here are seen as rapists.
You have to be taught how not to rape by a feminist
who is really fat.
'Now, these aren't really the dating tips that I was expecting.
'This is beginning to sound more like a conspiracy theory.'
The bad news...
..is that we haven't hit the bottom.
Do you think that eventually this will become a political movement?
And if the answer is yes...
I'd like to put in my application to work for you.
LAUGHTER
That is not a joke.
I have a daughter and sometimes I do fear for her upbringing.
I think I'm doing a fairly good job. I try and set, you know,
a good moral guideline for her to follow.
But what am I going to do to stop her from becoming
the worst of what we see in society today?
You should give her a man to marry at a young age - 18.
At least when she is 30, you have three or four grandkids.
Or she is going to be what?
She is going to work in a job, one bad boy after the next.
Many of you, actually, are going to use her.
I don't think you should give her the freedom and the choice.
What does Reggie think about what we discussed today?
It's been a much broader talk than I expected, in all honesty.
I sort of came here expecting to hear how to pick up women.
But it seems to be more about masculinity more than anything else.
Now, I take it that you have achieved a level of fame here.
How have you leveraged that fame to sleep with the women that you want?
- LAUGHTER - I really want to know that.
Like, is it easy? Like, do girls just come up to you?
I've been doing what I do for a long time.
I started in television when I was eight years old,
so this isn't new to me any more.
- Are you gay? - LAUGHTER
No.
- I'm actually engaged to be married. - Oh, OK. All right, never mind.
Yeah.
Out of interest, just how big do you think what it is that
you are doing here will actually get?
- The sites that I run touch over one million people every month. - Wow.
And maybe they are not willing to come here and pay,
but the ideas that I share is growing and growing.
All right, follow me out, lads, please.
'And then, just when I think no-one will go on camera,
'two men agree to meet me outside.'
Adam runs his own business
and Lorenzo is studying to be a barrister.
So, what is it that has actually brought you guys here today?
Why have you decided to come down?
Well, what has brought me here really is I thought there's
sort of that concerted attempt to shut men up, recently.
- Right. - The past few years. And we are sort of losing ground.
The BBC doesn't have a great, you know, doesn't get a great flak
when it comes to these sort of things at all.
They do seem to be on the side of what's, you know, what is right-on.
- Yeah. - And feminism is the fashionable cause.
What sort of man is attracted to an event like today, do you think?
Somebody who wants to engage with a very international,
as you can see, group of...
..concerned fellow travellers who...
..are interested in discussing these problems.
I mean, look in here. These people are now mixing together.
- And very few of them have met one another before. - Yeah.
The funny thing is, whilst these guys want to meet women,
and that is what Roosh sells,
some of them don't seem to like them very much.
And there are some really offensive strong views from what,
on face value, seems to be the meekest of the meek.
The most normal looking guys
and they have these views that are just unbelievable.
The thing that worries me most
is that a lot of the ideas that are coming out of that room
might be more commonplace than I probably assumed this morning.
Nevertheless, many of the men I met at the seminar claimed they had
to hide their views and their faces for fear of repercussions at work.
There is one guy whose view on this I'd really like to hear.
Comedian Daniel O'Reilly built an online audience in the millions with
short Vines showing proper geezer Dapper Laughs out on the pull...
- What is your name? - Carly. - Carly. Fuckin' she knows.
Carly. Carly. You are lovely. Sh! Hey, you're lovely.
I've always had a thing for lovely women. Do you want to see it?
Hey, hey!
..and landed himself a mainstream TV series off the back of his success.
Girls, all the girls down in front are always the same.
They start off in the beginning, "Dapper! Dapper!"
Halfway through the show, "Dapper! Dapper!"
- After the show... - MUFFLED VOICE: - "Dapper! Dapper!"
But Dapper's lavishness was branded sexist
and even misogynistic from the start.
And when it was alleged he made a joke about rape at a gig,
Daniel found himself on Newsnight, defending his entire act.
"Just show her your penis.
"If she cries, she is playing hard to get."
What you're saying is that women who say no don't mean no.
No disrespect to you, do you think, looking at me now,
that I actually would go out and do that?
Although Daniel apologised, his TV show was cancelled.
But his character Dapper Laughs lives on.
The only reason I wear a condom, right,
is to stop the girl getting pregnant.
But I've got a couple of other tips for you.
Get yourself one of them morning-after pills, yeah?
Crush it up, put it in her drink.
I'm joking! Respect women. Respect women.
From the sounds of it, Daniel hasn't made any changes.
And he is pretty unrepentant, despite all the flak.
Uh, who saw me on Newsnight? Who saw that?
AUDIENCE SHOUTS OUT
That interview was hard for me
cos it is the only time I've actually really played a character.
On the outside, I'm going, "No, of course that is not acceptable to
"go up to women and say, 'Get your gash out.'"
- On the inside, I'm going... - HE LAUGHS
.."Can you get your fucking gash out?"
Hey-hey! Enjoy the rest of your night.
Thank you very much for coming. Bye-bye!
- Get some fucking beer. - How do think that went?
- The show was great. - Yeah? - Yeah.
And it seems as though your crowd is very much
- sort of predominantly young men, 25 and under. - Yeah, but I mean...
- Why do you think that is the crowd? - You saw a lot of women there though.
Yeah, exactly. I mean, don't get me wrong.
I'll get to the girls, but the mainstay of your crowd is young men.
- Why do you think that is? - I think just cos I started...
When I started off doing the comedy,
I was really trying to take the piss out of men's attitudes.
"Ey, fuckin' she knows," like.
And a lot of people don't want to go
and laugh at political satire or current affairs.
Sometimes they just want to laugh at something that is easy to laugh at.
Why do you think women come to your shows?
Unless you've got... a cause to fight.
Like, you're a feminist or you are against sexism or...
Unless you've got a cause to fight,
a lot of the young girls can see I'm taking the piss out of men.
Do you think that it's the reason that what happened to you happened
was because you made a joke about something as serious as rape?
Or do think it happened because of your particular brand of humour?
I think it happened because I blew out...I blew up
outside of the conventional way of becoming...
It wasn't that one incident,
it was just the speed that you got to where you were?
I was getting shit from the outside.
I was getting stuff from them, same journalists, same people,
months before that.
They were just looking for something.
My family, personally, has been affected by sexual violence.
It's not a joke, do you know what I mean?
And the only reason why I quit at the time is
because what the media were putting on the family.
It was horrible.
I always judge how well I'm doing in life by what my mum says.
And my mum has not been offended by anything that I've fucking
put out there.
She knows I'm taking the piss out of men.
But, listen, do you know what they're doing in the media now?
They won't go, "Oh, I didn't find it funny.
"But I respect his audience
"and that he is allowed to do that brand of comedy."
They will say, "It's shit."
I think the UK, especially the media, needs to decide
whether or not they want freedom of speech or they want to stop
people being offended by comedy. I think comedy is the last...
the last avenue we've got.
It's comedy that, like, do you know... What's next?
You're going to stop... You're going to ban people watching horror movies?
Cos someone is going to go out and kill someone.
If I say something on stage and someone goes out and does it,
they're screwed in the head. That's got nothing to do with me.
Do you ever worry about the way that it could be taken
out of context or the way it could offend?
Yeah. Pff, it depends on who was in the audience.
I ain't going to be taken out of context from my fans
- because my fans will watch and go... - HE LAUGHS
"I heard the same stuff on the building site yesterday."
Do you know what I mean?
That all got, uh, a bit emotional.
And I can understand why.
You know, this is a man who feels as though he lost his moment,
his opportunity.
But unfortunately, whether he wants to admit it to himself
at the moment or not,
he is normalising a certain level of humour
that a lot of people find offensive
and a lot of people have a real problem with.
Real equality feminists today have a real problem with
the mainstream feminist,
because the mainstream feminists are radical Marxist feminists.
Feminism...
Speakers' Corner in London has always been a place for people
to meet and share controversial views.
And today is no exception.
Men rape, men rape.
That's all we hear about - that men are rapists and child abusers.
This is what feminism has been talking about.
So then face the penis!
She yelled. You notice what she did then?
What she did is she simplifies things down to saying that
I'm a woman-hater.
Rod is a men's rights activist
and is determined no-one is going to shut him up.
Men don't need your help!
They do need our help.
- WOMAN SHOUTS IN BACKGROUND - They need our help very much. Our problem...
Well done. That got a bit intense, didn't it?
It does, but you get heckled to pieces.
Do you think coming here to Speakers' Corner week on week
- is going to actually change anything? - Yes.
Because what happens, we often see a young man
standing in the background, doesn't say anything, stays for hours.
Hello, everybody. My name is Josh. I'm 18, I'm from Essex.
In my spare time, I do a YouTube channel
and a blog about gender politics and men's issues.
'There is another crowd gathered around a second speaker.
'But there is something different here.'
What is the obstacle to getting men's issues addressed in society?
'He is just a teenager.'
People don't know what men's issues are.
Domestic violence against men is not treated seriously.
When numerous places have done tests where
they got women to hit men in public, people have laughed
and taken videos and said, "Oh, he probably deserves it."
And the opposite never happens.
Thanks for listening.
Just out of interest, what put this on your radar?
Why would you say the issues that men are dealing with
is such a problem for you?
Men's issues, I feel like, they are far...
Particularly young voices, there are far too few.
I mean, we've got the Minister for Women and Equalities here in the UK.
We've got the European Parliament Committee on Women's Rights
and we've got UN Women.
We have no comparative organisations for men.
So, I'm pretty confident that women's issues are being dealt with.
Men's issues, not so much.
I hadn't expected young guys like this to be
so angry about what they see as discrimination against men.
Meanwhile, Roosh's world tour has rumbled onto Canada.
But he has run into some local opposition.
The Toronto media, Toronto Star, city news, every channel...
I'm the leading newscast. Me.
A random writer from the US who wants to meet with 40 guys
just to have fun with them and talk to them.
'But it's not just Roosh.
'With a few clicks,
'I'm starting to realise these kinds of views are easy to find.'
Now, this idea of what Roosh is about and what
he stands for seems to be a small part of a much bigger
conversation, because on Roosh's website, there is mention of this
thing I've never heard of before,
and it is called the Manosphere.
No, it's a real thing.
"The Manosphere is a name given to an informal network of blogs,
"websites and internet commentators that focuses on issues relating
"to men and masculinity, often in opposition to feminism."
There are sites for men interested in pick-up tips,
men's rights activism
and other groups I've never heard of.
Across the board, sex, bodybuilding and issues like divorce
and unemployment come up again and again.
But the hottest topic of all?
Feminism.
I've never really been in an environment where anyone at any
point has ever said that they have an issue with feminism.
And I kind of thought that was something
everyone in the modern world thought,
but, oh, how wrong am I!
Growing up with four sisters, you want to see them blossom
and you don't see anything that could help that as being negative.
But being at Roosh's seminar,
the word feminism seemed to come up over and over again.
And it was never presented in a positive light.
Almost everyone here is choosing to hide their identity,
just like at Roosh's talk.
But there is one name that comes up all the time and he is a real person.
"All hail High Lord Yiannopoulos. May he watch over you.
"LOL, that guy is awesome."
British journalist Milo Yiannopoulos has written for The Telegraph,
news sites and has his face all over YouTube.
He seems to have done an incredible job of continuously arguing
with journalists and politicians and feminists,
and people love him.
"Does feminism make women ugly?"
This is a piece that Milo has actually written.
He feels like someone that I need to have a chat with.
And it turns out,
with a growing profile as a self-proclaimed antifeminist,
Milo is only too happy to meet with me.
- Nice to meet you. - Good to meet you too. How are you? - Yeah, good. Thanks.
Listen, you are the perfect person for me to speak to at this point.
- I met Roosh V very recently. - OK, cool.
And I have sort of been made hip to this whole idea of the Manosphere.
Can you sort of explain to me what the Manosphere is
- and what it is broken up into? - Yeah.
I mean, it is a very eccentric sort of group of men who feel
dissatisfied with the way that society is going,
the way that relationships between men and women are organized.
And I think a lot of men are feeling as though their traditional role
as provider has been, you know, diluted to such point
they're not really sure
what they're supposed to be there for any more.
And what a lot of the pick-up artists, people like Roosh,
do for these guys is give them a renewed sense of purpose.
A lot of these young boys are very worried that they will be
alone forever.
A lot of them are worried they won't ever get good jobs
and they will never get a decent pension.
And they sort of just don't know where they fit.
It kind of feels like it is two sides going against each other.
You've got the Manosphere and all of the permutations of that
and then you have got feminism.
- Yes. - What is your take on that?
What's happened to feminism in the last sort of 20 years is
it's become very tied up with very far-left activist politics.
And this particular brand of feminism,
which says that women shouldn't just be equal to men,
they should be the same as men -
if they want sort of grow their hair and get fat,
then they should be allowed to - ignores basic biological realities.
It also ignores some of the things that are different
about men and women and different ways
that men and women look for happiness.
I think that the state of gender relations, the understanding and
happiness between the two sexes,
is at its worst, probably, for 100 years.
And I think that you could reasonably say that feminism
has a large part to play in that.
'Now, I find these views surprising. And I'm not a feminist.
'But you don't have to be one to be challenged by Milo's point of view.'
- I've had messages about you prior to us meeting. - Oh, really?
- Yeah, of course. - And what were they saying?
"This guy is going to stitch us up. I can tell.
"I can tell he will stitch us up."
And I can't blame them for this
cos it has happened to them so many times before.
Over and over again, they are just outright lied about.
Right.
He has made it really clear that people are worried about me.
LAUGHING: I don't know why they're worried about me. What have I done?
It's mental that, you know, I'm so early on in this journey
and already people are paranoid that I'm out to get them.
There seems to be this weird sense of paranoia in this world.
It's frustrating to be judged before I've even begun.
I want to see if I can persuade anyone from these secretive
online groups to meet me face-to-face.
The top of my list - these guys.
MGTOW. Which stands for Men Going Their Own Way.
It's a website only for men.
And they have got the best logo ever.
Their logo is essentially a man kneeling to a woman holding up
his credit card. It's phenomenal.
Let's dig a bit deeper, shall we?
One of the most popular posts on here is "Marriage, mortgage, kids...
"Fuck that shit."
This MGTOW site looks slick and they have clearly spent money on it.
So you might think someone involved would be happy to explain why.
Apparently not.
'There has been an awakening. Have you felt it?'
We've actually managed to get in touch with the MGTOW people
and they were actually happy to meet me.
They wanted to chat and they wanted to allow me in
to find out a little bit more about them and their beliefs.
But they've had a massive U-turn.
And off the back of that U-turn, they have started discussing me
and what it is I'm trying to achieve, online.
Now when I say discussing, what I mean is putting up video blogs
on YouTube and it is not just the one video.
There are shitloads.
'Hello? Hello?
'Hello, gentlemen. This is CS MGTOW.
'I wanted to post a quick update about the BBC attempting to
'throw MGTOW under the bus.
'And, personally, I will never work with the media.
'And I certainly have no trust for the BBC.
'I believe that there is no chance that the mainstream media
'will ever be supportive of our message.'
Hang on, we haven't done anything yet!
HE LAUGHS
'Yeah, man, for the love of God, please don't show your faces.
'Seriously. Seriously.'
"For the love of God!"
'You will be fucked for life, especially
- 'if you want to take a job...' - "Fucked for life."
'..or do anything with your lives.'
- 'I agree. - Yeah.' - What?
We haven't met anyone yet and put them on camera from MGTOW. Um...
How are we... Why do we have an agenda against the movement?
That makes absolutely no sense.
'Some of these anti-BBC videos have had thousands of views already.
'So, maybe YouTube is the best way to try and set up a talk.'
This could be the worst idea ever,
but I think it is worth having a crack at.
Hello there, MGTOW. My name is Reggie Yates.
Some of you know that, most of you probably don't.
I'm in your world now.
All that I want to do is make a programme that features you
and your beliefs, where they come from and who exactly you are.
So, get in touch. Thank you.
I do think there is a small chance that we may have a conversation,
but I think it will be on their terms.
And if that means it's a Google chat,
if that means it is via the comments section, so be it.
It's 2015, dammit.
MGTOW may be reluctant to talk, but I am still intrigued by that
young guy standing on a soap box in Hyde Park.
Welcome to feminist idiocy.
In contrast to feminist hypocrisy, this series is simply me
explaining issues that feminists talk about that are ridiculous.
'Josh told the crowd to check out his videos on YouTube. So I have.
'And the content is far more extreme than anything he said in the park.'
So, the best way to discuss rape and the chances of it happening
is to take the emotional element out of the question.
Cos that is why feminists are shitty at discussing rape.
That was it.
What on earth is it that is inspiring someone so young to say so much,
and why does he feels as strongly as he does at such a young age?
At 18, I wasn't thinking like this.
'We are now approaching Colchester.'
Josh has agreed to meet me at his home.
I want to find out what is behind his views.
- There he is. - Hi. - Hello, how are you doing, Josh? - I'm good, and you?
- I'm good also. Thank you for having me in your home. - Oh, it's OK.
Why have you got an Anfield Road sign up?
- Am I in a Liverpool football club? - Dad is a big Liverpool fan.
Oh, get me out of here!
- So, you live with your parents? - Yeah, Mum and Dad.
- All right. - This is the room. - Here we go. Right, OK.
- What are you working on over here then? - This is the script...
You've got a massive sort of document.
- Oh, you write scripts for your videos? - Yeah, I do script them.
I used to not but then I just ramble and go off on a tangent
and have to edit loads of stuff out.
That is a script for part one of my drunk sex series.
'Josh is recording today.
'The latest in a series on how men can be unfairly accused of rape.'
OK, I need to see the studio.
Studio is probably a generous term. It's just our spare room.
The people who owned this house before us had a very young daughter,
- so it is decorated for like a two-year-old girl. - Oh, right. OK.
- So... - LAUGHS: You weren't joking! - No, it's...
You really aren't joking.
That... Mum bought that as a joke
cos it went with the room in a sort of funny way.
- That is not a serious thing. - OK. So, this is where you shoot your videos?
- This is it? - Basically, yeah. It's a tiny little set. - This is the chair?
- That is the chair. - Can I sit in the chair?
- You're welcome to sit in it. - Look at this.
Do you not think that it's crazy that, you know, you are literally
sat here in your spare room with a camcorder and a bit of a script and
suddenly people all over the world have access to your points of view?
It's insane. Insane.
I've got, you know, just over 2,000 subscribers watching these
videos and liking what they see.
I want to see you do what you do.
- OK, yeah, I can do that. - Let's do it then. Can I help in any way?
Erm... At the moment, the camera only works when it is plugged in,
so I'm going to have to do that.
If it loads. Come on.
So, what is the theme of the video then?
Measurements of drunk sex.
So, what is drunk?
Just out of interest, why is this issue on your radar right now?
I read an article in I think Huffington Post
about California's new "yes means yes" law.
So, the basis of your thinkpiece, if you want to call it that,
have come from what exactly?
Erm... Mostly from just sort of thinking about it, really.
It's just something...
A lot of the things I talk about are things you can understand
- if you just think about them in more detail. - Mm.
Hello, everybody. Welcome to drunk sex, a treatise in three parts.
So, uh, r...
Let's try that one again.
Hello, everybody. Welcome to drunk sex, a treatise in three parts.
This is part one - measurements.
So, drunk sex, a lot of feminists are now saying, is rape.
Think about the perils just of going on holiday.
I could find a girl here in the UK, we could have sex,
it's fine, she is not too drunk, she is still legally able to drive.
We go to a US state with a stricter rule and suddenly I'm a rapist.
OK, right... It also has to be something
that people can be expected...
'At 18, Josh is not afraid to speak out. I'm just not sure why.'
This will overwhelmingly be a burden on men.
Thank you very much for watching, I've been Josh.
Boom. And just like that, it's done.
Yeah, just as my SD card ran out of memory. Perfect.
- I had to cut a little bit out for that. - Wow.
What is really fascinating about you, Josh, is your age.
You know, you are so young.
Over the years, I've met activists all over the world
fighting for different causes and the thing that is consistent
in all of those people that I've met is that there is a reason.
What is your reason?
I don't really have a satisfying answer to that question.
People ask me all the time.
It's not like I had some big life-changing experience
like a lot of people do.
You know, a lot of the people I speak to in the men's movement,
they went to a troubling divorce or they were abused by a partner
or they were raped.
It was never like that for me.
As a living, I'd like to be, you know, a men's issues speaker.
Or I'd like to join a think tank that talks about these issues.
Something like that.
This is something I want to do for the rest of my life.
- Is this... - Mum's. - ..Mum's or yours? - That's Mum's.
Mine is in the sink, actually.
Let's grab a seat out here. Look at this. Perfect.
How do women react to your views? Particularly your mum.
I mean, you live at home. How does she react to some of the things
that you say in your videos?
Nothing I say in my videos is anti-woman,
but some women do treat it as if it's an attack on women.
I wouldn't talk about women's issues and feminism at all
if I didn't think I needed to for men's issues.
So, if it wasn't the case that our domestic violence laws
were heavily influenced by feminist academia, I wouldn't speak about it.
What gets picked on? What is it that they jump on?
I talk about false rape claims.
I say false rape accusations are really harmful to someone's life.
People have been killed by mobs without a court case
ever taking place.
And I try and talk about that and they accuse me
of derailing the conversation because false rape accusations
are only 2%, even though we can't get an accurate study on that.
It's more you are not focusing on the right issues than
you are actively promoting something that is anti-women.
False rape claims are disgusting and that is one of my worst nightmares,
to be accused for a crime, serve time for something I definitely didn't do.
But...
The fact that rape exists and the fact that it is such an issue
and the fact that it is happening, it is happening on every street
and people aren't talking about it. It is a real issue.
Yes, but I don't...
It's not like I'm hearing someone talk about how bad rape is
and I'm like, "Oh, also false rape accusations."
- No, it is a complete separate thing. - I'm trying to get to the bottom of...
why so little of your time is dedicated to being 18.
- Cos you're only 18 once. - I do spend my time being 18. I do.
This doesn't take up, like, half of my time.
But, I think I have an advantage over the men
who have had their lives derailed
purely because I'm not coming at it from an emotional angle,
which means... Cos if you are emotional about something,
it can lead to you being aggressive.
Josh is a really impressive speaker.
But I can't help worrying that he's building opinions about how
women behave based on other men's bad experiences that he has found online.
Before he has even had a chance to live his own life.
And there is nothing wrong with fighting for men's rights.
There is nothing wrong with believing that there should be equality.
But when your own personal experience with women has been hard,
has been unfavourable, and that then affects the way that you
view the world, to then present that as the gospel is where things
get dangerous, especially when you are looking at how many young men
this is beginning to affect.
'But at least Josh is prepared to stand up,
'be counted and meet me face-to-face.
'The men of MGTOW, not so much.
'But my video, well, let's just say that it has had a reaction.'
"Fuck off." "Fuck off, you BBC poodle."
What is a BBC poodle? I don't even know what that is.
Now, we did hear back from the head honchos of MGTOW.
They gave me one possible time to chat.
But when I couldn't make that time work, the shutters came down.
Back in the digital world though,
plenty of other people have had their say.
There are tonnes of voices on here. Someone called Tater Bater
has said, "I know the main voices in the community don't
"trust your intentions, Reggie,
"but I would really have liked to have seen MGTOW
"put its best foot forward.
"For what it is worth, you're tackling something really out there."
Spider says,
"Fellow MGTOW, I don't understand the reactions to this issue.
"I am MGTOW because I believe in male self-determination.
"I support MGTOW and do not fear anyone knowing it."
So, you have got someone here who is confident in his reasoning,
his belief and also confident in the MGTOW movement.
And then you get the other end of the spectrum.
"Only a fool would trust this dude. Fuck off. Fuck off, all of you."
"No wonder this guy works for the BBC, he has one."
Oh, he's making a cock joke. "BBC stands for big black cock."
"Now I get why Queen Victoria got rid of slavery before America did."
"Isn't Queen Victoria the original Queen of Spades?" Jesus.
The comments have gone from the ridiculous at times,
right the way through to, for some reason, the racist.
There is one guy here called Paul Merritt who is asking,
"Why so much negative backlash?"
And someone else has said that there is a lot of burnt people commenting.
The thing that really stands out to me
isn't that there is a lot of burnt people commenting,
it's that there is a lot of people aggressively coming at me.
This aggressive reaction from some of these men, I'm just confused by.
If this is what I'm receiving after literally sticking my tiny
brown pinkie toe into the pool that is the Manosphere,
what is it like for a feminist?
What is it like for someone who says, "I disagree with you guys."
I don't know.
Nice(!)
Journalist Laurie Penny has written about both
men's rights activism and sexism on the net.
She has agreed to talk about the kind of response she gets when she does.
So, exactly what sort of interaction have you had with these guys online?
Well, in terms of threats, I've had everything ranging from...
..individual attacks, people sending me pictures of, like,
gross pornography with my head pasted on.
Getting fisted by Hitler.
I had a bomb threat sent to my house.
Well, people saying they knew where my house was.
I had to leave, so did my landlord.
People really want to intimidate me
and anybody who writes about feminism online.
Could you show me some of the messages you've actually received?
Yeah, well, I'm not totally happy with them showing on camera,
but you can have a look at them.
Yeah, I mean, people just send that sort of nonsense to me.
That is one of the milder ones.
- Oh, my God. So... - Yeah, that was last week. - That's...
- They actually found a picture of you and pasted it onto... - Yeah, that.
..onto that image.
- Yeah. - Why are you specifically being targeted?
Well, it is not me specifically.
It is every woman who writes about feminism on the internet
to some extent. I'm absolutely not the only one.
The intention is to silence people and shut them down.
I think it is very ironic that these men's rights activists claim
that they feel silenced when they are organising to silence women.
What is it that it is motivating these men to do this?
I mean, what is the problem that they have that is manifesting
itself in sending these images, do you think?
Erm... There is a lot of genuine frustration behind
the men's rights activist movement.
I understand the emotions that are behind that
sense of powerlessness and feeling of loss of power.
The trouble is that whilst feelings are valid, it is
what you do with those feelings that makes the decision about
who you are as a human being.
So, what is driving hate like this?
And who are these people?
In 2013, even a simple campaign to commemorate
Jane Austen on a ã10 note resulted in a barrage of
vile abuse sent to female campaign leaders.
Threats of violence and rape
were traced to a young man called John Nimmo.
- Why did you send those messages? - I can't say nowt else.
He was arrested, tried and jailed.
I'm actually really surprised that he has agreed to meet me.
After serving four weeks of an eight-week sentence,
John is now back home in South Shields.
I don't even know where to begin on why you'd want to do that to someone.
Hopefully he can explain it himself.
'I'm not sure what to expect.
'I've never met a real-life troll before.'
- Hello. - Hello. - Hey, John? - Yep. - Reggie.
- Nice to meet you. Can I come in? - Yeah.
- How's it going? - All right. - So, you're living alone at the moment? - Yeah. - Mm.
- And, well, a messy kitchen. - Yeah.
Does your fiancee stay around much?
Erm, a few days a week.
'John seems very happy to talk.'
- Come on, mate. - Let me just get... - Yeah, you grab that.
'He has even prepared a few notes.'
That's the... All the things I said.
Wow.
"The police will do nothing, smiley face."
"Rape her nice ass."
You threatened to rape her in these messages.
I wouldn't... I wouldn't... You know, it was just... Yeah, trolling.
It's not stuff I would actually do.
So, what made you feel comfortable enough to do it online
- if you wouldn't do it in the real world? - Erm...
I saw it trending on Twitter.
That, you know, what was happening.
And I'm thinking nowt's going to happen here
so I thought, "Why not just join in?"
You started talking to this woman in quite an aggressively sexual
manner very quickly.
Why?
I saw what other people were tweeting and stupid me
replied the one that tweets that.
I think what people said so I just continued and continued.
What sort of response were you hoping to get? What were you hoping to do?
It was attention seeking. That's all trolling is, is attention seeking.
What is the feeling then when you get a reply from someone
who you are sending horrible messages to?
Is it happiness? Does it feel like a victory?
It felt like...
I know I shouldn't say this, but an achievement.
"The police will do nothing. It is only Twitter."
"Making me laugh now. Shut up, bitch."
"You're not that good-looking to rape you. I will find you. Smiley face."
'The way John describes it, he got caught up in a moment.
'But it was a moment that lasted two whole days
'and he hid it all from his unsuspecting girlfriend.'
How were you able to say this to another woman that you didn't
know when there is someone that you do love who I'm sure you would
hate to have this happen to her?
I was stupid to do it. It was stupid.
I mean, let's be honest.
The fact that you were doing it at night and not telling anyone
and you were doing it alone says to me that on some level you knew
that what you were doing was wrong.
At the time.
Yeah, probably, yeah.
I didn't think I was going to get arrested and all that
so, you know, I just carried on.
Some of those messages were really sinister,
like, "I will find you, smiley face." Like, what? That...
That would make anybody feel a little uneasy at least,
especially if it is coming over and over again
from different accounts from
someone who seems really confident that they are not going to be caught.
I think going to prison, for him, was probably the best thing
cos he now understands that he can't do that.
Free speech is one thing, but threats of rape or worse
feels different to me and they are becoming more and more common online.
I just don't get where all this hate is coming from.
'But I know a man who might.' How are you doing?
- How are you doing, you all right? - 'Milo Yiannopoulos.'
- So, yesterday I spent a bit of time with a guy called John Nimmo. - Yeah.
He is a young man who lives in Newcastle who actually spent
- four weeks behind bars for trolling. - Yeah.
On Twitter, he sent, over two days, a barrage of messages to a feminist.
MILO LAUGHS Why are you laughing?
Why is that funny to you?
I think it's hysterical that people get locked up
for what they post on Twitter.
I mean, the extent to which free speech has evaporated
in this country is amazing.
- But there is free speech, surely... - So what?
..and then there's sending threatening messages.
He might've sworn at her and called her disgusting things,
but it's not a reason to lock somebody up.
Well, you say that.
I also met Laurie who is a feminist, one I know that you are aware of.
And Laurie has received unbelievable messages,
which go from "I know where you live" to "I'm watching you right now" to
"I'm going to do XYZ to you tonight."
- They don't believe this stuff. - It is scary. - It's not...
- Look. - Oh, come on. - Listen, this is the typical
bait and switch that happens with progressive activists, right?
You goad people, you egg them on, you deliberately provoke them
and then suddenly you turn around and play the victim
cos you've got messages that you don't like.
Well, I'm sorry, but if your entire career is based around telling
white men that there is something wrong with them,
you can't then complain when you get messages on Twitter saying
that somebody wants to hurt you.
Why do you think men resort to using the word rape so often?
Cos that is one of the things that John said over and over
that he ended up behind bars for.
What the studies show is that men and women
use slightly different language when they lose their temper.
Women tend to call each other sluts and bitches and whores
and that sort of stuff.
Rape, as a sort of expression of power and domination,
is more what men go for when they lose their temper,
like they might threaten to beat you up.
What does this mean for men moving forward?
That men can't win an argument in the public sphere
unless you watch your language so carefully.
When they speak out, they lose their jobs.
Or they get just as much trolling as any feminist activist.
But that is the dysfunctional situation we've got ourselves into
precisely cos men are terrified to speak out about this stuff.
Milo seems to be saying women are just being given too much,
even too much protection.
But with everything I've heard and read online,
I'm finding it harder than ever to see men as the victimised sex.
So, where does that leave someone like Roosh V?
I go to the supermarket to be a pervert,
to film that girl's ass.
And another girl's ass.
I've had to fly to Poland to find out.
He just wasn't meeting the right kind of girls in America.
They cut their hair short.
They are so lazy to maintain long hair that they make
themselves ugly on purpose.
So he moved here a year ago,
to a small university town full of female students.
And before we meet, there is
just time for a refresher on his back catalogue.
Now, there is a lot of Roosh V books,
which are available on huge websites online, by the way.
Anyone can buy this stuff
and the sort of thing that is in these books is, erm...
Yeah, it's...
not the sort of thing that I'd want my younger brother to read.
"It took four hours of foreplay and at least 30 repetitions of,
"'No, Roosh, no' until she allowed my penis to enter her vagina.
"No means no until it means yes."
That is actually written here.
"While walking to my place, I realised how drunk she was.
"In America, having sex with her would have been rape
"since she couldn't legally give her consent.
"It didn't help matters that I was relatively sober,
"but I can't say that I cared or even hesitated."
It's actually illegal to force someone
to have sex in Iceland too, Roosh.
"I know that when it comes to sex,
"one ounce of hesitation or feeling of morality will get me nothing."
That one actually leaves a nasty taste to your mouth.
'At his seminar, Roosh told me
'he has one million visitors a month to his sites.
'And one of the articles he posted there earlier this year
'caused horror around the world.'
There's a piece that he's actually written on his website
called How To Stop Rape. And...
There is a section here that reads,
"I thought about this problem and I'm sure I have the solution.
"Make rape legal if done on private property.
"I propose that we make the violent taking of a woman
"not punishable by law when done off of public grounds."
Basically you're saying, if you rape someone on private grounds,
in a private residence, it should be OK.
That is fucking disgusting.
This isn't about confidence.
You know, 30 Bangs isn't about making young men
feel as though they have value.
This is about making young women feel as though they have none.
'Roosh is now back from the Canadian leg of his world tour
'where there was a furious reaction to his article on rape.
'The mayors of Montreal and Toronto tried to ban him
'and he was even physically attacked in the street.
'Now, I'm about to meet this mammoth of the Manosphere in his own home.'
- Hey, Reg, how is it going? - Very good, thank you.
- I haven't seen you in a while. - It's a shoes-off house, isn't it?
- Yes, please, shoes off. - OK, no worries.
I maintain a clean home.
- It's a big old apartment you've got here. - Here's the bed.
- One of the signs I used in the lecture... - Oh, my God.
I found a way to use it here.
REGGIE LAUGHS
Oh, Roosh, really? Is that...
Tell me you put that up for my benefit.
- Is that normally there? - No... I mean, this sign, I hope, will stay here.
Again, I know you already saw this sign in London,
but I think there is another use of it that I can use here.
And I work here, so all the genius that you may have
come across that I've put out starts there.
- What's in the kitchen? - Ahh... - Is it pure muscle-building foods?
Look at that. No, it's healthy food.
We've got vegetables, eggs, cheeses, wholefoods, right?
But sometimes if a girl comes over, you know,
you got to give her the supermarket champagne...
- I was going to say... Prosecco. - ..that I bought on sale.
- You're really spoiling her. - But they don't know that.
They don't know that.
So, how long has it been since you got back from Canada?
- Or the world touring? - I've only been back for about five days.
I'm still recovering from the drama there.
They took one article I wrote called How To Stop Rape.
It was a satirical thought experiment
that the way to reduce rape is to encourage women
to take responsibility for what they do,
and I said we should legalise rape.
Which, of course, is an absurd notion.
- I've actually read that. - Yeah.
- But they took it... - I read the piece. And it is...
You use the word satirical and it is quite hard to find
the satirical angle to it when you're actually reading it.
The point I am trying to make is what would happen
if we took this absurd notion and took it in a literal sense?
Well, women would just take more care of themselves like
they take care of their smartphone, their purse and their car.
But what the media did, they said, "He is a rape advocate."
'I'm surprised at how indignant Roosh seems
'at how his rape article was taken,
'and he is desperate to show me video of his attack.'
This is what happens when you give females choice.
They choose to do this.
This is me in a wig
and these girls are throwing drinks at me.
And now the anger is coming up.
'You're a piece of shit. How dare you fucking come to Canada.
'How dare you fucking come to my country.'
SHOUTING ON VIDEO
This is a violent mob. All because the media frothed these people up.
THEY SHOUT BACK AND FORTH
What were you hoping to achieve by writing things like this,
especially when you know you're getting that kind of reaction?
Then we have to ask ourselves - are we going to self-censor?
How far are we willing to go to apply a filter to what
we believe is right to free speech?
My goal as a writer is to make sure that my ideas spread far and wide.
So, of course, satire is going to be misinterpreted.
But to be misinterpreted by everyone in Canada,
all the media and even the politicians
who came out against me, seems to be a deliberate action of theirs
to paint me as someone that I'm not.
'Roosh can't seem to see himself as anything but the victim in this.
'Despite so many people's horror in what he wrote.
'I'm wondering if he will take any responsibility
'for what he's telling young men about sex.'
One of the things that really troubled me,
particularly from a point of view of someone who has a younger
brother who is in his teens, if he were to read that book,
for instance, and read the passage "no means no until it means yes,"
I'd be really concerned about what that might do in his mind.
I can understand but I don't agree that the writing
I share crosses a line. I advocate for consensual sex.
But we have to understand how sex actually happens.
We both know that if you bring a woman into your apartment
and she, with a smile, says, "No, we're not going to do anything,"
does that actually mean no? Is that when you stop and ask her to leave?
Of course, no means no, and I have to state that. Then you stop.
Wait until she is ready to go farther and then you go on.
But in your book you talk about a situation where there is
a woman who is half asleep and you "jammed it in,"
I believe is the words that you used, which is so horrible.
- But haven't you done that when a girl was half asleep? - No!
A girl that you already had sex with, you've never done...
- It wasn't the first time I had sex with her. - No. - Are you sure?
- Yeah, I'm pretty sure. - OK, listen.
I mean, I'm sure you've had sex with girls who were on some
kind of alcohol or something else. Does that mean that you raped them?
Of course not.
So, if you want to examine every instance, every thrust,
maybe you can find something.
But this can happen to every man.
Roosh, thank you for having me in your home.
No more articles on how to rape women.
- I think I'm done with the rape issue. - I think you should leave that for now.
- I think I've made the point, you know? - Yeah...
- Well, you made A point. - OK, man, take care.
It was an issue when I was growing up and it seems to be an issue now
and that is that young men need role models.
They always have and they always will.
And it just seems as though this movement
is providing role models,
just a different kind to the ones that I agree with.
I think if you have got a man to look up to that is telling you that
you will be all right and that is showing you how to navigate
this weird world,
then you might just survive.
But if you have got someone whose view is massively skewed
and massively influenced by their own inadequacies or issues...
..then you are going to have some of your own.
My worry is that there are a tonne of young men who are desperately
searching for something and are finding it in the Manosphere,
when in reality,
what they actually need is...is they need a confidence boost
and they need someone to show them
that you don't have to be this way to be successful
in any part of your life, particularly when it comes to women.